Instant Tears of Realization w/ Lindi End of Seeking Session
This podcast episode delves into the intricate relationship between thoughts, self-awareness, and the pursuit of clarity. The central theme revolves around the idea that seeking enlightenment or freedom from thoughts often leads to a deeper entanglement in them, reinforcing the notion that the mind can become a hoarder of beliefs and concepts. The speakers share personal experiences, including moments of profound realization and emotional connection with the world around them, illustrating how simplicity and presence can bring about a sense of peace. They emphasize that true clarity exists beyond the labels and narratives we build around our experiences. Ultimately, the conversation encourages listeners to embrace the present moment and recognize that what they seek may already be within reach, free from the constraints of past and future thinking.
To book a private session https://www.emersonnonduality.com/book-online
Transcript
Sa.
Speaker B:Foreign.
Speaker B:Hi.
Speaker B:Hello.
Speaker A:Happy New Year.
Speaker B:Happy New Year.
Speaker B:How nice to meet you.
Speaker B:Thank you.
Speaker B:I'm so sorry about missing.
Speaker B:I thought it was later in the day for that last meeting.
Speaker A:No worries.
Speaker B:I don't know what was going on there.
Speaker A:No worries.
Speaker A:Unfortunately I was fully booked at the.
Speaker A:Otherwise I would have put you in the next lot.
Speaker A:But yeah, I was, I was wondering, I'm like maybe she missed the time and that's okay.
Speaker B:Yeah, I totally missed it.
Speaker B:It was just my brain.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:So Lindy, tell me your story.
Speaker B:Well, the character story, the Lindy that was made up.
Speaker B:I've probably been looking for this since I was young.
Speaker B:Coming back to that, I, I have memories as a child of almost an aerial view of myself walking on the ground and fun little things like floating out of my body at night and feeling very peaceful.
Speaker B:As everyone there's trauma.
Speaker B:So this, this, the thoughts started looking for something better and it turned into self improvement.
Speaker B:Of course I'm old, so Zig Ziglar, Brian Tracy, people like that who spoke about caring for others and also improving yourself.
Speaker B:And my husband and I, we've been married over 32 years or more both on the same path all the way.
Speaker B:Yeah, I wanted him to come on.
Speaker B:I know he's going to be listening.
Speaker B:He's working.
Speaker B:But so yeah, and we over probably Covid or a little bit before we kind of pop back into stuff.
Speaker B:So, you know, it's been, oh, I don't know, Rhonda Byrne.
Speaker B:We, you know, hopped around on the secret.
Speaker B:I followed Dr.
Speaker B:Joe Dispenza and went to like three of his events.
Speaker B:I've been in that like beautiful place where everybody's meditating at a very high.
Speaker A:Was it in Mexico?
Speaker B:Yes, I've done Cancun.
Speaker B:Denver maybe.
Speaker B:Denver twice.
Speaker B:Yeah, Mexico.
Speaker B:There's something going on in Mexico.
Speaker B:It's gorgeous.
Speaker B:So followed him and then you know, Bruce Lipton and all those folks and understanding the brain but then that's also using thoughts.
Speaker B:And we tripped upon my husband first.
Speaker B:He's just literally researching it all the time.
Speaker B:Found Terence Stevens and you know, Sailor Bob.
Speaker B:Terence Stevens is a student and, and Terence really finally we digested this concept really of the thoughts will go on like weather.
Speaker B:They're just gonna always go on.
Speaker B:So there's been a few times when I felt like, oh, this is, this is, this is it, this is me, this is, you know, and I had a beautiful experience in Cancun where I realized, wait, I'm part of this.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker B:Oh, I know you.
Speaker B:It was like this whole feeling with meditation.
Speaker B:Oh, I know you.
Speaker B:Then it was, wait, I'm part of you.
Speaker B:And it was just beautiful.
Speaker B:And then the seeking, seeking, seeking.
Speaker B:After that.
Speaker A:Of course.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:So that's basically where I am.
Speaker B:And then I just.
Speaker B:Michael found you.
Speaker B:Michael's my husband, Mike.
Speaker B:And I was like, oh, my God.
Speaker B:Just like.
Speaker B:There's one woman you talk to.
Speaker B:I think her name is Belinda or Melinda.
Speaker B:And every time she started to talk, you.
Speaker B:You would say, what is it you always say?
Speaker B:Now I'm trying to think.
Speaker B:That's irrelevant.
Speaker B:That's irrelevant.
Speaker B:That's irrelevant.
Speaker B:And then the part about sobering up, those really.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Kind of resonated here.
Speaker B:So that's kind of why I wanted to speak with you, because.
Speaker B:Yeah, the thoughts.
Speaker B:Yeah, the thoughts.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:You know, I was a seeker for a long, long time too, and I became a spiritual teacher in the line of, like, Joe this, you know, like all that kind of stuff.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:But I saw that no one was getting out.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So I felt like a big fraud.
Speaker A:I'm like, what am I doing?
Speaker A:You know?
Speaker A:Anyway, I've said that you probably heard that story now in my one on ones.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Definitely listened and watched many of those.
Speaker B:For sure.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So there's just this new newness to this where there is just a very direct, you know, simple.
Speaker A:That it is possible to end seeking.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:It doesn't have to go on.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Because it just will just keep on, you know, reinforcing.
Speaker A:That there is something missing with you.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:That there is something lacking.
Speaker A:And that there's something that you can do.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:The doing.
Speaker B:Like if you just do this thing, then you'll be whole and.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And it's just.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:The mind, but it reinforces that there's something missing in the first place.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:So what's between doing and not doing?
Speaker B:I know.
Speaker B:I hear you say this all the time, just directly.
Speaker B:Nothing is between.
Speaker A:Yeah, but who's saying that nothing?
Speaker B:The mind, the thoughts.
Speaker A:But what's behind the mind.
Speaker A:There you go.
Speaker A:That simple.
Speaker A:If you just uncover or enlabel everything, then what you're looking for is in the direct, not in the opposites of words.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So what's behind the thoughts?
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:The thoughts just want to say, why are you crying?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:There's a.
Speaker A:There's a realization that does not need any words.
Speaker A:That's why.
Speaker A:And sometimes tears come out.
Speaker A:Laughter happens.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Because it's an instant realization that what if what you're looking for is already here?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Next.
Speaker A:It's not in the past.
Speaker A:It's right here.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And I said this to someone.
Speaker A:What if you're staring at God all the time?
Speaker A:You just have words that.
Speaker A:It's not an idea.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:What are you without words?
Speaker A:What are you without thoughts at this moment?
Speaker B:Well, the thoughts keep coming in.
Speaker A:What if it's irrelevant?
Speaker A:See?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:It's okay.
Speaker A:Stay in this moment.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:It's.
Speaker A:It's.
Speaker A:It's.
Speaker A:There's a quietness here.
Speaker A:What's between God and not God?
Speaker A:There you go.
Speaker A:What's between thoughts and no thoughts?
Speaker A:There you go.
Speaker A:So there is this something that I can't even say that is present.
Speaker A:You know what I'm saying?
Speaker A:That's just.
Speaker A:It's beautiful because it's.
Speaker A:It's.
Speaker A:It's innocent.
Speaker A:Like going back into that childhood when you're flying around and everything.
Speaker A:You didn't have any words.
Speaker A:You didn't have any belief.
Speaker A:It was just magical, isn't it?
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:So in this openness, there's magic.
Speaker A:Basically.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And it's so freeing.
Speaker B:It feels the thoughts want to say, this isn't real.
Speaker B:There's.
Speaker B:There's all kinds of.
Speaker B:Like, this is temporary and.
Speaker A:Yeah, but what's between real and not real?
Speaker A:What's between temporary and not temporary?
Speaker A:See, the thought wants to land at something so that you believe in it again.
Speaker A:So you can go back into that thing.
Speaker A:What if that thought is irrelevant?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Where's that coming from anyway?
Speaker B:Who's behind it?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:There you go.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:How are you feeling right now?
Speaker B:There's a.
Speaker B:There's a floating feeling and there's fear.
Speaker B:Or there's a sensation of fear.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Of.
Speaker B:This can't be.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:What if you enlabel that fear?
Speaker A:What's behind it?
Speaker A:Go directly at it and label it.
Speaker B:This feels like we're just home.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Welcome back.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:This is where you never left, right?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:This is.
Speaker A:This is that.
Speaker A:That space that.
Speaker A:It's just clear.
Speaker A:And of course, doubts and fear are going to come because it's trying to, you know, navigate you away from this.
Speaker A:But it's here.
Speaker A:You've been here before, right?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:We were always here.
Speaker A:We're always here.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And if you take away the words and definitions and meanings, if you enlabel this, what are you without Language?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:There's no language.
Speaker B:There's no language.
Speaker B:Then there's no.
Speaker A:There you go.
Speaker A:See?
Speaker A:See, the clarity is just not here.
Speaker A:It's also there.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:It's not.
Speaker A:It's not Something that I passed on to you.
Speaker A:It's just.
Speaker A:It's just basically.
Speaker A:I just unlabeled you.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:It's almost like there is just an undoing, basically.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Rather than going to the next, trying to do this and everything just in the present moment, if you take away all the narratives, there's something here that is home, basically.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:It's like if you're not thinking it's paradise, but the moment that you think it's not.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:Such a dirty trick.
Speaker A:It's such a dirty trick.
Speaker A:It's a.
Speaker A:It's an illusion, right?
Speaker A:Yeah, it's like.
Speaker A:It's like a well, well played illusion.
Speaker A:Like, wow, I've been bamboozled all my life with my thoughts.
Speaker A:But now you're gonna see.
Speaker A:See it clearly over and over and over again.
Speaker B:I just.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:And here goes the thinking again.
Speaker A:Like, it's okay.
Speaker B:This isn't.
Speaker B:You can't have this.
Speaker A:Yeah, That's a thinking of lack again, right?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:What is that?
Speaker B:Oh, my favorite teacher, Michael Singer.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Is really, you know, really helped in terms of seeing like all that.
Speaker B:But then he also.
Speaker B:This is where I love to talk to you about, like, so this becomes a constant concept of there's trapped energy that needs to come out of me before I can.
Speaker A:No, that's right.
Speaker A:No, I love.
Speaker A:I love Michael Singer too.
Speaker A:But that's just going into narratives.
Speaker B:It's more thought.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker A:It's more thought.
Speaker B:Another concept that I have to.
Speaker B:I have this holding on to, oh, I'm gonna have this trapped energy till I don't.
Speaker B:I have to release it every minute, like until it's gone.
Speaker B:It might be a whole lifetime.
Speaker A:No, see, that's just gatekeeping there.
Speaker A:I love him.
Speaker A:He's a great old man.
Speaker A:You know what I'm saying?
Speaker A:And.
Speaker B:Oh, he is.
Speaker B:He's lovely.
Speaker A:But, you know, he's just basically regurgitating a lot of the other teachings.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:Yeah, yes, yes, you're right.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:Because if you're using any kind of thought, then you are absolutely staying in the me character, which.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And I, I appreciate.
Speaker A:I appreciate Michael Singer because you know what?
Speaker A:There was a time that I was binging him basically right about.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker A:And I also did the.
Speaker A:The other part of the Embedded Soul, you know, like the workshops and everything.
Speaker B:Oh, you even did.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah, so did I.
Speaker B:We did those too.
Speaker B:Right?
Speaker B:The eighth day series.
Speaker B:Eight week series and.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yes, yes.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:But that's thought.
Speaker B:That's thought.
Speaker B:Talking about.
Speaker A:It's all thought.
Speaker A:It's Just the thought.
Speaker A:Maintaining a thought.
Speaker A:You know, it just goes back and forth, back and forth, back and forth.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And then people don't like it when I say that there's no such thing as contracted energy or trapped energy.
Speaker A:It's just a thought.
Speaker B:It's a thought believing a thought.
Speaker A:It is.
Speaker A:Yeah, it's.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And you know what?
Speaker A:It.
Speaker A:It did piss off some teachers when I said that.
Speaker A:You know, saying.
Speaker A:But guess what?
Speaker A:If you believe in that, you'll be caught up in that teaching.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:You'll be working on something over and over again, reinforcing that there's something missing.
Speaker A:See?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:How sad it is.
Speaker A:Yeah, it is.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And, you know, much love to teachers and everything, but they're just repeating their gurus, you know, and people.
Speaker A:So this new kind of like, whatever this is.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:I don't even want to take credit for it.
Speaker A:It's just basically standing up.
Speaker A:And, you know, I kept on waiting for the guru to slap me, slap the girl, and leave with clarity, with respect, you know?
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:Because there's nothing needed.
Speaker A:Because they're just basically reinforcing more thoughts.
Speaker B:They are.
Speaker B:They are.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:If I could just.
Speaker B:Or pushing away thoughts.
Speaker B:So I shouldn't have any thoughts.
Speaker A:That's right.
Speaker A:Exactly.
Speaker A:That's just another thought.
Speaker B:The other side with Dispenza would be.
Speaker B:I'd be in a very deep meditation.
Speaker B:Then a thought would come in.
Speaker B:You're not getting this.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Oh, like, wait, that's more thought.
Speaker B:That's not even.
Speaker B:It is seeking something to feel better.
Speaker B:So my physical body has a lot going on.
Speaker B:And I heard you talk about how you did, too.
Speaker A:Oh, my goodness.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Food.
Speaker B:You know, just like, I'm not girl in a bubble.
Speaker B:But it's.
Speaker B:It's just become a cycle of thought and conversation and physical pain and.
Speaker B:And I'm continuing to perpetuate.
Speaker B:I understand the neuroscience that apparently this body can create cells or maybe that's just concept.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Pathways of continued sickness.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:That's creating more concepts.
Speaker A:This is creating more stuff.
Speaker A:Like, for example, with me, I kept on trying to think that there was something wrong with me, and then my body would feel, you know, like I went vegan, vegetarian, all that kind of stuff.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:And I just kept on purifying myself.
Speaker A:At one point, I'm like, a friend of mine said, how much more do you need to purify, Emerson, Your skin and bones now?
Speaker A:And I'm like.
Speaker A:I'm like, I'm not.
Speaker A:You know, and then you.
Speaker A:And you don't even look at yourself.
Speaker A:In the mirror anymore because you're so caught up.
Speaker A:I.
Speaker A:I went to the extreme of it, right?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:I went to the extreme of it.
Speaker A:Not for a long time, because luckily, I love to eat.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:So here I am, you know, like, fully alive, just loving life and everything.
Speaker A:And then I had to diminish myself because I thought that there was something wrong with me.
Speaker B:Yeah, there's a.
Speaker B:There.
Speaker B:There have been, over the course of several years, a lot of negative thoughts like that.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:You should know better.
Speaker B:Why?
Speaker B:What.
Speaker B:What is.
Speaker B:Yeah, all of this.
Speaker A:Oh, yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:All of it is like.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And I'm.
Speaker B:I'm so.
Speaker B:I'm a former preschool teacher for many years.
Speaker B:Loved it.
Speaker B:Prior to that, I did clinical hypnotherapy.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker B:And now I'm doing it again.
Speaker A:Oh, cool.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I love it because the teaching that I have been taught is to just allow that person's inner wisdom to decide what they need to heal from.
Speaker B:And I use this really beautifully artfully vague stuff.
Speaker B:I don't talk to them about their issue.
Speaker B:They hit a goal.
Speaker B:I just ask them to remove stuff and it leaves perfect.
Speaker B:Like, is that a thought?
Speaker B:Is that a bad thing for me to do?
Speaker B:You know?
Speaker B:But it's gorgeous.
Speaker B:I've worked with people who have never mentioned stuff that they were hurting from, and it left them.
Speaker B:So I want to keep doing this.
Speaker B:I work with a galaxy, and she had horrendous childhood.
Speaker B:And I said, you don't need to talk to me about it.
Speaker B:We're in the terror.
Speaker B:You don't need to talk to me about it.
Speaker B:And we just did the same, different instruction, and she healed from things.
Speaker B:I know I don't have any responsibility for this.
Speaker B:I just love this art form or whatever the heck it is.
Speaker B:She just completely transformed.
Speaker B:I saw her, like, a year later.
Speaker B:I didn't recognize her.
Speaker B:She said, you were right.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker B:I just needed.
Speaker B:I said, you need to give it time, because.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:But she left her thoughts.
Speaker B:Left her about.
Speaker B:I think the experience is what I would guess.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker A:There you go.
Speaker A:There you go.
Speaker A:Right There's.
Speaker A:In between, you know, whatever.
Speaker A:Right there is this directness, and then you're just being direct, and that's why you love it.
Speaker B:Actually, I'm there when I'm in session with people.
Speaker B:I just realized that's what that is.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Oh, yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:I literally just.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:That's it.
Speaker A:That's me.
Speaker B:It's us.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:We're just there, and it's just.
Speaker A:Or a Better ways.
Speaker A:You get out of the way, the thoughts out of the way.
Speaker B:Always.
Speaker B:Yeah, always.
Speaker A:You're present, you're.
Speaker A:You're.
Speaker A:You're connected, basically.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:So the opposite of addiction is connection.
Speaker A:So we get addicted to our thoughts and we disconnect with this connection, whatever this is.
Speaker B:Oh, you're right.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:That's the thought.
Speaker B:Fear is that I'm just gonna keep returning to the thoughts.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, the thoughts.
Speaker A:Maintain the thoughts.
Speaker A:It's like the moment that you take a shot of the past, a shot of the future, then you're caught up.
Speaker A:You're intoxicated, you're drunk with thoughts.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:You sober up in the moment, right?
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:So what was you said, so sober up.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:So the thoughts want to create tools to keep doing that.
Speaker A:The thoughts will only come up with shots of the future or the past.
Speaker A:Right?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Don't drink the shot.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:Yep.
Speaker A:Because it's irrelevant.
Speaker B:That's what you kept saying.
Speaker A:It's irrelevant.
Speaker A:It's irrelevant.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's irrelevant.
Speaker B:It's all irrelevant.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:It's beautiful, this clarity right now.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:It's just, it's.
Speaker A:It's clear, it's sober.
Speaker A:You know what I'm saying?
Speaker A:It's.
Speaker A:It's pristine.
Speaker A:There's just this.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:You're out of the way.
Speaker A:I'm out of the way.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So it's.
Speaker A:This is not about me.
Speaker A:This is not about you.
Speaker A:There's something here that's not neither you or I.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:But it's.
Speaker A:It's something that we can't say.
Speaker B:Something you can't say.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:And it's.
Speaker A:This is how simple it is.
Speaker B:It's interesting how complicated it looked.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:It was very, very familiar.
Speaker A:It is.
Speaker A:This is kind of like, you know what?
Speaker A:This is just more story, but this is prior to knowledge, prior to language, prior to time.
Speaker A:Because we believe in language, we believe in time.
Speaker A:We get caught up, you know, the moment and then we are.
Speaker A:We're basically like a self preservation.
Speaker A:We're making up this self over and over again.
Speaker B:Right?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Construct it and build it.
Speaker A:Oh, yeah.
Speaker B:Or reshape it.
Speaker B:It's almost like if you were building a structure in the sand and you were trying to make this and build it up and then it would fall.
Speaker B:But then you're going to keep building and making.
Speaker A:It's like building, building sand castles over.
Speaker B:And over again, over and over again.
Speaker B:Because I want to get this right.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:They're never going to be solid.
Speaker A:No, no, no.
Speaker A:The moment the next day happens.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:It's flat again on the ground.
Speaker A:So you build it again.
Speaker A:Build it again.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:True.
Speaker A:Or like Sisyphus.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:You know, like the guy that was like pushing this rock on top of a mountain and then it falls down and then he pushes it again.
Speaker B:That used to be my dream as a kid.
Speaker B:It was my.
Speaker B:Well, actually, it was carrying heavy rocks.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So where are those rocks right now?
Speaker B:I don't carry them anymore.
Speaker A:There you go.
Speaker B:I don't.
Speaker B:I don't carry them.
Speaker A:For me, after this clarity, I was so heavy with thoughts and beliefs, and not just my beliefs, but I carried many, many teachers beliefs, books upon books.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:And I had an opinion about everything.
Speaker A:I was like an encyclopedic, like, knowledge of like the scriptures and everything.
Speaker A:And I carried that.
Speaker A:And I was always right and someone was always wrong.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah.
Speaker B:Anyone that got into my field in the past, I always wanted to fix everyone.
Speaker B:Everyone, Everyone needs to know this or whatever.
Speaker B:This is their ticket to freedom.
Speaker A:Right, Exactly.
Speaker B:I'll help.
Speaker B:I'll give you the information because I don't want you to hurt.
Speaker B:That's the whole story that.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Was here.
Speaker A:You know, but now what you're doing basically is you just can.
Speaker A:Like someone's carrying.
Speaker A:If you don't know what they're carrying, you're like, hey, here, hand it to me.
Speaker A:Like, put it down.
Speaker A:That's basically it.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:Whatever you're carrying, put it down.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:It's.
Speaker A:It's, it's.
Speaker A:It's okay.
Speaker A:You don't have to carry it.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:Well, I don't have to do it for them either.
Speaker B:That's the.
Speaker A:Exactly.
Speaker A:That's just another narrative.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:That's the one that I can feel here now.
Speaker A:So simple.
Speaker B:I don't know why I'm crying.
Speaker A:It's okay.
Speaker B:When I was little, my mom.
Speaker B:I love her very much.
Speaker B:She passed.
Speaker B:We had a lot of time with her.
Speaker B:She had cancer too, at the end.
Speaker B:And as a, As a kid, she was mentally ill, so there was part of her that wanted to save the world.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And the way that she wanted to was to create a peace center where people from everywhere would come together.
Speaker B:She.
Speaker B:She gave us that responsibility.
Speaker B:She did the thoughts, did, you know, whatever.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:Caught on, caught up with it.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So almost got.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:So I think that would be this weird thing that's always sitting there is to heal the world or something.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Even though you know it's not your responsibility, that's where the thought patterns yeah.
Speaker A:So if you look at this very moment.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Who is there to heal?
Speaker B:Who is there to heal?
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:Or what is there to heal?
Speaker B:Well, actually, the brain goes to my kids, the thoughts go to.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:To the young ones who, you know, have, you know, sad times or whatever else.
Speaker B:That's.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:But if you can't go to the past or the future, what's.
Speaker A:Oh, yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:It's amazing.
Speaker A:It is.
Speaker A:There you go.
Speaker A:So if you see every moment like this, just no pass or future, then there's, then there's perfection in everything that seems to appear.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:There's nothing to fix or not fix, basically, because it's just this.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:For example, if I see someone crossing this tree, then they need help at the moment, I help them.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:But I'm not going to be.
Speaker A:But in that moment.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:But I'm not going to be worrying about all the people crossing the street that can cross the street.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Or, or thinking about all the people that were not helped crossing the street.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:You're, you're talking helped me already with that.
Speaker B:I have done that.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Where I just went.
Speaker B:Wait, right now.
Speaker B:Oh, okay.
Speaker B:This is fine.
Speaker B:Right now.
Speaker A:It is.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah, it is.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:It's very direct and clear at this moment.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:It's just, it's just there's almost like a flow, but something also that never moves.
Speaker A:It's a flowing, but it's not moving.
Speaker A:It doesn't make sense.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:So this is not a state.
Speaker A:This is the ordinary, the, the directness.
Speaker A:Basically, the state is the mind.
Speaker A:The mind comes in and out, but something here never moves.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:There's something clear here.
Speaker B:Huh?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And it's always in the present, but it's easy to get caught up.
Speaker A:You know what I'm saying?
Speaker A:Ride that train that goes to the past or ride that train that goes to the future.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:It's good to catch.
Speaker B:I, I do see that happening now, since listening to you, where I'll.
Speaker B:I could catch that and then just come back to here.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:The here does not hear.
Speaker A:This is not a construct.
Speaker B:It's not a time.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:There's no time.
Speaker B:I, I get.
Speaker B:I, I, theoretically, that makes complete sense.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:You only act in where you are.
Speaker A:Yeah, it does.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And then if you look at it, it's not even getting rid of thoughts.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Because for me, for example, you know what?
Speaker A:It's, it doesn't matter thoughts or no thoughts, it's just, who cares?
Speaker A:It's irrelevant.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And then when it becomes Irrelevant.
Speaker A:Over and over again.
Speaker A:You know what you'll notice all of a sudden you're like, what the hell?
Speaker A:There's not even thinking happening.
Speaker A:It's just very direct.
Speaker A:Like right now.
Speaker A:Like if you.
Speaker A:If you watch who's talking, the voice that's coming out of your mouth, is there a prior to it?
Speaker B:No, I've noticed that before.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Sometimes almost like, what was that?
Speaker B:Like, what was that?
Speaker B:Yeah, just.
Speaker A:Yeah, it's very direct, isn't it?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:I heard you say something about what was that?
Speaker B:You were going to eat or have a cup of something or soup.
Speaker B:And then later on it was, I think I'll take a drink or.
Speaker B:But you'd already done it or.
Speaker A:Yeah, right.
Speaker B:The automaticness that happens, and then the thoughts just kind of float in later, like for a millisecond later.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Spontaneity.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:It's always.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:You think that you're thinking, but even you thinking that you're thinking is just a thought.
Speaker A:Everything is very direct.
Speaker A:There's a thought that tries to create this.
Speaker A:This diversion, basically, that there's a past or a future, right?
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:And we're caught up in that.
Speaker A:We're caught up in that story that there's a past or future.
Speaker A:Because in the directness or, you know, this immediacy, I don't even understand that.
Speaker A:The past and the future, if you look at it, it's just a story.
Speaker A:Where is it?
Speaker B:It's in.
Speaker B:It's literally in between your ears.
Speaker B:I don't even know.
Speaker B:Somewhere.
Speaker B:But it's.
Speaker B:It's all.
Speaker B:It's like mist or something.
Speaker A:It's a mist.
Speaker A:Yeah, like a, you know, like.
Speaker A:What do you call those again?
Speaker A:A fog.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:It is a fog.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:I want to figure some thoughts.
Speaker B:Want to figure out how to not focus on that.
Speaker B:I can see that coming up.
Speaker B:But that's irrelevant.
Speaker A:That's irrelevant because it's just trying to go to the next.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:See?
Speaker B:Yeah, it is.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:It's going into the future already.
Speaker A:Already.
Speaker B:That little fog story of.
Speaker B:Well, as soon as you disconnect from the zoom, that's the whole story that's just showing up right now.
Speaker A:Oh, totally, Totally.
Speaker A:I was just talking to a guy that.
Speaker A:That I talked to a year ago, and then he said, oh, my goodness, it was beautiful roller coaster.
Speaker A:Because after the session, basically he said, I'm good.
Speaker A:I made it.
Speaker A:And I said, call me anytime you need me.
Speaker A:He did not.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So he was just kind of like.
Speaker A:And then he just went into a.
Speaker A:The opposite.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:All of A sudden, he started believing that I'm good and everyone else is not good.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, he grabbed that thought.
Speaker A:He grabbed that thought.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:How long did that go?
Speaker A:Well, he reconnected.
Speaker A:He started watching the, you know, the one and ones, you know, like six months ago.
Speaker A:Oh, and then he said.
Speaker A:And then after the one and ones, he was like, oh, my goodness, I feel so foolish now.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:It's like.
Speaker A:It's not about a landing, about the destination, because this is.
Speaker A:This is as fluid as water, basically.
Speaker A:It's a never ending over.
Speaker A:It's a never ending unfolding because the moment that you think that you've stopped, you've arrived.
Speaker A:You've not arrived yet.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Because you're back in thinking.
Speaker B:You're focusing.
Speaker A:Thinking.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Since I've started listening to you, I will see that happen and then I'll stop and.
Speaker B:And I'll just be here again.
Speaker B:And I feel like it's sped up in.
Speaker B:In some way to looking at a whole bunch of, you know, thoughts.
Speaker B:And then I'll just be like, oh, that's irrelevant.
Speaker B:What?
Speaker B:Where I am is here.
Speaker B:Yeah, I'm catching it.
Speaker B:But I could see.
Speaker B:I actually.
Speaker B:I can't see how.
Speaker B:Well, I think it's all the matter of if you follow a thought, then.
Speaker B:Then you're in that fog until he's.
Speaker A:Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:So he was following the thought of him being good.
Speaker A:Oh, yeah.
Speaker B:That's a good thought to think.
Speaker B:I mean, if it's productive, for sure.
Speaker A:Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:For.
Speaker A:For him, he's arrived, that he's done and everything.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And then it went into another cycle.
Speaker A:And all of a sudden he.
Speaker A:He was saying that, oh, you know what?
Speaker A:I actually got it more than Emerson.
Speaker A:I'm like, there's no such thing as more or less.
Speaker A:Because that's just the thought.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Because if he really got it, then he would not any.
Speaker A:Anyway was just making a whole bunch.
Speaker B:Yes, I know what you mean.
Speaker B:It was the thought that was feeding on the thought that was creating another.
Speaker A:That's right.
Speaker A:That's right.
Speaker A:Yeah, that's right.
Speaker B:When you.
Speaker B:I think what you said hit me recently was a concept, because a concept is a jumble of thoughts and beliefs.
Speaker A:That's right.
Speaker B:That's almost the bigger thing is this concept that's just floating around.
Speaker B:You're thinking, and you're in it, and you're thinking, oh, this must be.
Speaker B:This is.
Speaker B:And then you're like, wait, like, I can catch myself.
Speaker B:And I'm like, oh, my God, I just went down a Whole story about what, what you need to feel like where.
Speaker B:When you've.
Speaker B:And I'm like, oh, my God, thoughts are back in thoughts again.
Speaker B:Like.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:The moment that you think that I'm the only one.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:You know what?
Speaker A:I got it.
Speaker A:I made it.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Oh, look how enlightened I am or how awake I become.
Speaker A:That's just another thought.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So this is just complete humility.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:It humbles me, this stuff.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Because the moment that I meet someone, there's really no hierarchy here.
Speaker A:There's equality here, isn't it?
Speaker B:I feel the same way.
Speaker B:I know sometimes I can get, like, emotional when I.
Speaker B:It's probably mostly when I'm working with people, but sometimes it's just like a connection you have with someone and you're like, I.
Speaker B:I tend to be like a.
Speaker B:I, whatever that this, this just loving gushiness comes out and I'm like, I got to tamper that back because I have really feel love, like.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Easily with other people.
Speaker B:I, this expression comes out and I'm like, yeah, I don't know.
Speaker B:I felt that way.
Speaker B:Sometimes I can be in love with a total stranger.
Speaker B:I'm talking to them and I'm just feeling, like, so connected.
Speaker B:I'm like, yeah.
Speaker B:I'm like, what is this?
Speaker A:That's great.
Speaker A:You know, you're probably great at what you do.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:We're not part, we're not apart.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And there's usually gratitude, like this engagement, this connection that I have.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:For a second in the grocery store, and I'm like, right.
Speaker B:Or whatever.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And that's, that's what, that's what, you know, when we see like a beautiful sunrise or a sunset, because we're not apart from that, that's when we cry.
Speaker B:I, I.
Speaker B:Okay, so I have a sweet story.
Speaker B:My dad's going through dementia right now, and, but he can still talk and engage, but it's not ever going to the past, which actually, it's pretty gorgeous.
Speaker B:No future.
Speaker B:There's a part of dementia that's very peaceful for him because we'll say, how are you?
Speaker B:And he's like, I'm just, I'm just loving it.
Speaker B:I'm living in now.
Speaker B:He'll say that, like, that's beautiful.
Speaker B:He doesn't have torture thoughts, so he's getting a good version of it.
Speaker B:So I said to him, like two weeks ago, I said, you know, I call him Daddy.
Speaker B:I said, hey, Daddy, I have something.
Speaker B:We were looking at the clouds and I said, I have, I have something to tell You.
Speaker B:But it seems kind of strange, but I was looking at the clouds one day and I said, I swear they made me cry.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker B:I didn't make me cry.
Speaker B:Whatever.
Speaker B:You know, words are just words.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:I was just so in love and just.
Speaker B:And he said, you know, kiddo, I know I'm just the right person to hear that.
Speaker B:And I don't know why, but I.
Speaker B:I understand.
Speaker B:Oh, that was like.
Speaker A:That gave me chills.
Speaker B:He.
Speaker B:He's.
Speaker B:I'm like, you do?
Speaker B:So there's that.
Speaker B:There's the.
Speaker B:Like you said the sunset or the clouds.
Speaker B:I'm like, I was crying over the clouds.
Speaker B:Oh, in a good way.
Speaker B:Just like.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And that's just us.
Speaker B:That's this beauty or whatever.
Speaker B:No name.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Being.
Speaker A:That's what it is.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Just no name.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:It's just clarity without language, Crying without stories.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:That's nice.
Speaker B:That's good.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And that's what happens to me, right?
Speaker A:Because I used to be so caught up in thoughts that I would hate waking up in the morning because I would try to go back to sleep because I'm just overly thinking about what's happening and what's wrong with me and what do I need to do.
Speaker A:So when.
Speaker A:When it finally dawned on me, I'm like, oh my goodness, I don't even have thoughts in the morning anymore.
Speaker A:I'm just like an automatic walking thing, you know, walking into walking my dog.
Speaker A:So it's just.
Speaker A:It's just this almost like an autumn, you know, like a just.
Speaker A:It's just.
Speaker A:It's just happening spontaneously, right?
Speaker A:And I didn't even notice it until like much later.
Speaker A:I'm like, oh, this is why I have so much contentment, is because the thoughts doesn't even land.
Speaker A:And then when I see the sunset, I just, you know, I'm not a crier, but I'm.
Speaker A:I cry a lot now, right?
Speaker A:I'm like.
Speaker A:Or sunrise.
Speaker A:I'm like, what is this?
Speaker B:Right?
Speaker A:Or this?
Speaker A:More.
Speaker A:There's this morning.
Speaker A:There's this morning because there's a.
Speaker A:I walk in a.
Speaker A:In a beautiful off leash trail.
Speaker A:There were like two Samoy dogs.
Speaker A:You know those white Samoy dogs that came to me and they were like, it's like there's a little bit of snow on the ground and I'm like, oh my God.
Speaker A:It's like talk about a vision in white, right?
Speaker A:It's like this, you know, and then my dog was just happy and I was just like tearing up.
Speaker A:I'm like, okay, I hope the owner doesn't come right away because I look like I'm.
Speaker A:You know, But I was like, oh, my God, he's so beautiful.
Speaker B:It's so beautiful.
Speaker A:It's just the ordinary, mundane things.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker A:It doesn't have to be this.
Speaker A:This glorious whatever, you know what I'm saying?
Speaker A:It's just the ordinary things.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And then on this trail, there is this cemetery, and then there was a cemetery with some Christmas lights that made me cry.
Speaker A:There's a tombstone with some Christmas lights, Right?
Speaker B:Oh, yeah.
Speaker A:I'm like, ah, the love.
Speaker A:Probably from that.
Speaker B:You know, the love there.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:So it's.
Speaker A:It's like I just see love over and over again, and I have words for it, but the words can't even label love.
Speaker A:It's an unlabeled love.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And the enlabel love is what you are.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:It's without the.
Speaker A:Without the labels.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Without the words.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's.
Speaker B:It is interesting that I've been spending a lot of time.
Speaker B:So overly emotional people are mentally unstable is an old concept that.
Speaker B:It's a concept.
Speaker B:It's what.
Speaker A:It's a concept.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And it was with me, but I.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:It's just who I.
Speaker B:That's why I love being with preschoolers.
Speaker A:Oh, that's.
Speaker B:Oh, I was so in love with my time with them and our experiences and.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:Oh, that must have been so beautiful.
Speaker B:Like, you talk about working with people who have autism and working with children.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Oh, my goodness.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Everything is fresh.
Speaker B:Everything is again okay.
Speaker B:And whole, and it only takes a minute.
Speaker B:Like, they could go through something, but the emotions are there, and then they're through, and then they're too.
Speaker A:I work with my.
Speaker A:My uncle.
Speaker A:My favorite person in the world is my uncle.
Speaker A:He's.
Speaker A:He has down syndrome.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker A:He's only, like, a few years older than me because my grandma had him late and.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker A:And I think he's just the heart of the family.
Speaker A:He's just so beautiful.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:And he would hold my hand, you know, say little boy, kind of like people were teasing him, you know, and in a small town.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Because during that time, they were kind of, like, ignorant about that.
Speaker B:Sure.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And he's just a beautiful, beautiful, you know, being basically.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:He would.
Speaker A:I would give him shirts, and he would save them because he did not want to, you know.
Speaker A:You would save them for special occasions.
Speaker A:Oh, that kind of thing.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:And so one time I was just really feeling depressed from depression, and I was just standing by the subway.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:And I was just kind of like so suicidal and, and so, you know, when, when you're, you know, when you are just seeking and seeking and nothing's happening and you're just feeling kind of like so distraught by it.
Speaker A:And out comes this subway train with a train full of.
Speaker A:Of little kids with down syndrome hiding, playing hide and seek.
Speaker A:Saw me and saw.
Speaker A:And then everything just become, you know, like, it's like a glimpse, basically.
Speaker A:It wasn't.
Speaker A:Everything became bright and saw their faces, innocent, playing with me, and then they hugged me.
Speaker A:It's just what I needed.
Speaker A:And I was like, of course I was, you know, touched by that.
Speaker A:Isn't it beautiful?
Speaker A:You know, I'm saying this life, because you come from the dark, the, the darkest depth of your mind, and all of a sudden there's this spark of joy of.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:A bunch of, you know, little kids that have down syndrome.
Speaker A:That's just the most beautiful thing.
Speaker A:Right?
Speaker A:It's just the most innocent thing.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:Gorgeous, right?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:So some people have, people have judgments about, you know, people with down syndrome and.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Wow.
Speaker A:They're, you know, if you ever met.
Speaker B:They're missing that heart.
Speaker A:They're missing out.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:It's just.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:Or.
Speaker A:Or kids with autism.
Speaker A:There's just some brilliance in them, right?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:It's just a spectrum of brilliance.
Speaker B:And it is.
Speaker A:You just have to uncover it.
Speaker A:I.
Speaker A:I talk to this sister, works.
Speaker B:With them, and she always says how much she loves her job.
Speaker B:And she.
Speaker B:Then she says, I was gonna wear that necklace, but I realized I can't because they could grab it and choke me.
Speaker B:And she's like, I love my job so much.
Speaker B:And I'm like, they're.
Speaker B:They're tall teenagers she works with.
Speaker A:Oh, yeah, she loves.
Speaker A:Loves.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:You just have to go directly beyond the labels and the spectrum and all that kind of stuff and just.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:The gifts are immense.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:The.
Speaker A:There was this.
Speaker A:I talked to this guy named Robert.
Speaker A:We made a video.
Speaker A:He did a one on one and he has a son that has, he has autism and.
Speaker B:Oh.
Speaker A:And he's shifting, Right.
Speaker A:This guy's shifting and unraveling in his clarity.
Speaker A:And he's just a, you know, he's just a great guy.
Speaker A:Like, imagine leaving his job to take full care of his son.
Speaker B:I might have heard that.
Speaker B:At least I know my husband Mike is.
Speaker B:Was talking about that interview for sure.
Speaker A:And, and the.
Speaker A:One of the last conversations that we have, I'm.
Speaker A:I'm compacting it.
Speaker A:He said that his son started writing poetry that was very non.
Speaker A:Dual and he Read me some of the poetry and I was just blown away.
Speaker A:It had daft.
Speaker A:It had, you know, clarity.
Speaker A:It had, you know, it was just so beautifully written.
Speaker A:And then he said, I thought he was just a little kid trapped in a.
Speaker A:You know, in a man's body, but he had this words that were just like, you know, I was like, that's a great poet right there.
Speaker A:And it's just so surprising, right?
Speaker A:The first, the first time that we did a one on one together, according to Robert, his son put down his iPad and they went outside and just looked at each other with clarity.
Speaker A:Something kind of like, you know, something clicked there or something.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So it's an unraveling.
Speaker A:This is a never ending unraveling of clarity.
Speaker A:Right?
Speaker A:So what we think we know, we just think we know what we believe.
Speaker A:We just believe.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:But if you take away the beliefs and the thoughts and the.
Speaker A:There's something that's so clear here, that is so clear that it cannot be captured in words.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:Very, very much so.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:I love the unraveling too, because since listening to you, I see things happen and then I.
Speaker B:It just seems like then there's just like awareness of.
Speaker B:Oh.
Speaker B:Like whatever, wherever it was, I'm not there now.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:You know.
Speaker B:Oh.
Speaker B:I was gonna say is the concept of it keeps ramping up.
Speaker B:Like waking up in the morning, there's all these thoughts and I.
Speaker B:And then I'm like, why am I having so many thoughts?
Speaker B:And I'm like, oh, I'm just spinning in a concept that's all irrelevant, you know?
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:It's easier to nip it at the bud because it becomes this almost like a.
Speaker A:Almost like a neurosis.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Like, you know, like if you.
Speaker A:If you have this thought and then all of a sudden it goes into the next hour, the next day, and then you're caught up in this thought that you have to do something.
Speaker A:Do you think that you have to save the world or, you know, correct someone, you know, whatever thought that you stuck or someone doesn't love you.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Over and over and over again, Right?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:It's just torture.
Speaker B:And then you just say, wait a minute, what was that?
Speaker B:You know.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, it's irrelevant.
Speaker B:It is irrelevant.
Speaker B:What were you saying?
Speaker B:Addicted to thoughts.
Speaker B:You with that one gal.
Speaker B:Some of the stuff you said was so.
Speaker B:It just hit so.
Speaker B:Well, you said, I'm sorry I keep interrupting you, but you know, I just want to be very direct here and.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Addicted to thoughts and sobering up really makes sense.
Speaker B:Yeah, it really does.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Because there's some sort of idea that if I could just keep thinking about this, then I will change my state.
Speaker A:Exactly.
Speaker A:Exactly.
Speaker A:And that's what seeking is.
Speaker A:It's just.
Speaker A:It's just addiction that has gone super, you know, so it has gone kind of like, you know, intense.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And because you don't even know the addiction, you're just so caught up in it, and you're.
Speaker A:You're just catching yourself in your thoughts over and over and over again.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And it's funny, right, because we start seeking to be free of thoughts only to drown in them.
Speaker B:Yeah, right.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:It's almost like a trap.
Speaker A:The moment that you seek to end suffering, you end up suffering more.
Speaker A:The moment that you seek to end thoughts, then you think more.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:No, thank you.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And it just gets.
Speaker A:It's just a.
Speaker A:It's just a beautiful.
Speaker A:You know, it's almost like a purging of this stuff, of all of the things that you held on to before.
Speaker A:I've said this before.
Speaker A:Like, the mind is like a hoarder, right?
Speaker A:So you've hoarded so many concepts and beliefs.
Speaker B:The mind is a hoarder.
Speaker A:It is.
Speaker A:It's like.
Speaker A:Have you ever seen a seeker's mind?
Speaker A:It's like, you know, watching those hoarder show, right?
Speaker A:It's just a whole bunch of stuff that's kind of like, you know, you can't even walk through it anymore because there's just that excellent.
Speaker A:Been kept.
Speaker A:So much stuff.
Speaker A:Right?
Speaker A:And then when the.
Speaker A:When the.
Speaker A:The unhoarders are coming, they're taking out like a decrepit, like, you know, table or something.
Speaker A:They're like, that's my meditation table, you know.
Speaker B:You know, there's value in that.
Speaker A:There's value in that.
Speaker A:I have.
Speaker A:I have.
Speaker A:You know, they're like.
Speaker A:But it's.
Speaker A:It's.
Speaker A:It's got, you know, termites, and it's falling apart and it's decrepit and they're like, no, no, put it back inside.
Speaker B:You're right.
Speaker B:You're right.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Oh, no, no, no.
Speaker A:That.
Speaker A:That, that.
Speaker A:That spirituality, you know, lampshade or something, it brings a lot of light.
Speaker A:They're like, it doesn't work anymore.
Speaker A:They're like, no, no, no, you have to keep that.
Speaker A:And they like, well, it's falling apart, that kind of thing, right?
Speaker A:So any belief systems that we have, we hoard and we don't question it.
Speaker A:Then we just store it.
Speaker B:Interesting that you're saying, and I really do love the work that's done through Dr.
Speaker B:Joe.
Speaker B:But even that I've been noticing myself not go back to it anymore.
Speaker B:Like, I don't.
Speaker B:I just kind of dropped it because there was something about it that was getting into a rut of thoughts about the meditation.
Speaker B:That's the whole thing, right.
Speaker B:That if I just get one more hit.
Speaker A:And I was a meditation teacher for 10 years.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:You know what I'm saying?
Speaker A:I'm not just saying this stuff, you know what I'm saying?
Speaker B:Because you.
Speaker B:You.
Speaker B:Because you're seeking that spot that, like.
Speaker B:I mean, there are spots in meditation where you're like, this is just beautiful.
Speaker A:It's great.
Speaker A:It's great.
Speaker A:But when that becomes your.
Speaker A:When you've hoarded that, you know what I'm saying?
Speaker A:And you just keep on maintaining that, because this is what will get me enlightened or this is what will wake me up, then you have just created.
Speaker B:You know, you just reminded me of something.
Speaker B:There's a WhatsApp group that I have stayed on touch, in touch with only by listening to their discussions for at least a year that I might go back to.
Speaker B:I'm literally hoarding that discussion group on an app.
Speaker B:And I should just.
Speaker A:Yeah, exit.
Speaker B:I should just exit it.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Because the mind keeps thinking every time I see that if I go back on, maybe I'll get healed from the next meditation that I'm in.
Speaker A:Yeah, the next.
Speaker A:The next.
Speaker A:The next.
Speaker A:The promise of the next that never comes.
Speaker B:The promise of the next.
Speaker B:For healing has been a very giant theme.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:I'm gonna watch out for that.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:And that's it.
Speaker A:Basically.
Speaker A:No one.
Speaker A:When you start seeing things unraveling, unfolding, then it just always.
Speaker A:And something clarity.
Speaker A:Because the moment that you think that you've arrived or not arrived at something, then that just involves like, okay, what do I have to do or not do now?
Speaker B:That's another thought.
Speaker A:It's just another thought.
Speaker A:It's just kind of like going, I need to.
Speaker B:I need to.
Speaker B:Anything that's still a thought.
Speaker A:And then.
Speaker A:And then the other thing is like, oh, I don't need to do that anymore.
Speaker A:That's just another thought.
Speaker B:That's a thought.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Maybe just allow whatever happens to.
Speaker B:Happens instead of having to pay.
Speaker A:What's between allowing and not allowing this.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Whatever it is.
Speaker A:So if one day you feel like deleting it, delete it.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:If not, it doesn't happen.
Speaker B:That's what doesn't matter.
Speaker A:It doesn't matter.
Speaker B:It doesn't matter.
Speaker A:The mind wants to find a space where it can land in, right.
Speaker A:Or it can, because it's an illusion.
Speaker A:So the illusion can only hide in an illusion.
Speaker A:So the ties in the illusory next or the illusory past.
Speaker A:The moment that you bring it to the present, you shine.
Speaker A:It's not there.
Speaker A:Where is it?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Where's the eye right now?
Speaker B:Where's the eye?
Speaker A:Yeah, the eye.
Speaker A:Do this.
Speaker A:I don't do that.
Speaker A:It's not here, right?
Speaker B:Not here.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:It's never been here.
Speaker B:Oh, my God.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:I didn't know that.
Speaker B:I mean, whatever.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker B:There's the.
Speaker B:I, I.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's.
Speaker A:It's just a word.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:It's just a thought.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Oh, interesting.
Speaker B:Huh?
Speaker B:That's good.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:That'S great.
Speaker B:That's great.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Huh.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:It's simple, isn't it?
Speaker A:It's very direct.
Speaker B:Yeah, it is.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Because the eye is the thoughts.
Speaker B:It is doing something.
Speaker B:Wow.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Well, I'm going to stop recording here.
Speaker A:I'm going to say something just second.
